The Heresy of Dispensationalism: How Christians Betrayed Christ for Israel w/ J.D. Hall

[0:00:01] Hello and welcome to another special edition of the Backlash After Hours. I'm your host David J. Riley. Rebecca and Cameron are off today, but they will be back tomorrow. So rest assured, we're going to be here in studio with a big show, IH, Hypocrite, coming live in studio. We'll be taking your super chats, talking about the news. So make sure you're following us on Rumble, on X, on YouTube, Tik Tok, and Instagram. [0:00:28] And of course, all of those links are available for you at the backlash.net. So, tonight we are going to be doing a second a follow-up episode uh to one that I had released a couple of weeks ago called Candlelight Christian Exposed. We were talking about this Zionist infiltration of Idaho politics, not only at the local level, but also at the state level. We were talking about some of the players involved, the connections to the deep state, to the military industrial complex uh that this church here in Celane has. And uh you know, I think it's an important issue. I don't think you know, if you happen to miss it, go back and watch it again uh or go back and watch it the first time if if you haven't seen it because it's not just a local North Idaho issue. It's an issue that everybody across the country is dealing with because these evangelical Zionist churches are absolutely everywhere and they are freaking out. They're freaking out because the youth are abandoning their support for the genocidal state of Israel. Uh they are uh lashing out at conservatives. They're bringing back cancel culture. And so this is something that I think everybody is dealing with and and hopefully everybody that watches this show will will learn something tonight. and and come away knowing a little bit more than they did. And specifically, we're going to be talking about dispensationalism. [0:01:54] Now, dispensationalism is this new newer anyway, uh, ideology, uh, Christian ideology that teaches that the state of Israel is God's special chosen nation and that the Jewish people are God's special chosen people. They're above criticism. They're above reproach. Anybody who says anything about America's foreign policy that isn't in line with what the Zionists in Washington DC and Tel Aviv want, anybody who goes against it will be called an anti-semite. So it's very important that we understand the ideology behind this, what's driving it. And to do that tonight, we've got a very special guest. [0:02:36] We have J Hall joining us. He is an author, a pmacist. Uh he's a prolific writer. He has a wonderful Substack that you can check out. The link will be in the show notes below. So without any further ado, I'd like to welcome JD Hall to the program. So thank you so much for uh joining me tonight, JD. Uh it's great to be able to talk with you. You know, one of the reasons I wanted to have this conversation is because, you know, I remember about four years ago, maybe five years ago, I was meeting with a legislator, an elected representative, uh, right after a book by Whitney Webb had come out called One Nation Under Blackmail about the Jeffrey Epstein uh, blackmail and how closely aligned to Israel it seemed that Jeffrey Epste was. [0:03:22] and we had a very good discussion and agreed about the dangers of foreign interference and foreign intelligence uh when it comes to American sovereignty and American interests. But as we were wrapping up the conversation, she said, "Listen, I just no matter what, I can't go against Israel because that would be going against God and what God wants." And I said, "But but they're they're raping kids. [0:03:52] They're trafficking children. What what do you what do you mean you don't want to go against God? Look at look at what these people have been doing." And I hit a brick wall. And the conversation ended and there was basically nowhere to go uh from there. And so that kind of was my first taste of really dealing with somebody uh that was involved with this kind of uh dispensationalism. [0:04:18] And so I was curious, can you can you give a definition of dispensationalism? What it is, how it operates, where it comes from, and what it means uh for Christians uh in general. >> Yeah, I I can do that. Um, so when when we're talking about dispensational premillennialism, it is a way of looking at how God has dealt with humanity. Um and throughout the course of church history from the days of the apostles to roughly 1821 um the view that was held by the church uh and I don't mean the view that was held like in by the majority of the church or by most within the church or throughout most of church history. The only view of the church was that uh which we call covenantal. And within the covenantal perspective, there were different esqueological schemes, whether it was historic premillennialism or or postmillennialism or amillennialism, but all of that operated within a covenantal view of how God dealt with humanity. uh chiefly and I'll just summarize that briefly. It's that there is a covenant of works by which God says listen obey these things and you'll live. Uh you you follow these rules and you can have eternal life. And of course that leads to death for everyone because no one follows that that that perfect law of God as we all as we ought. That's why we're told that we all fall short of the glory of God. But then there is a covenant of grace by which we can be saved not by what we've done but by what Christ has done. And that the covenant of works and the covenant of grace is a large overarching scheme that God has used throughout history to save his people. And that whether you are Jew or Gentile alike, those are the only two tracks. Now, the uh covenantal system would say there was a a period of time in the Old Testament before the covenant of grace came down in in flesh, so to speak, before it was coronated on earth through the Lord Jesus Christ. And that covenant was promised, so to speak. So, Abraham, Moses, David, they weren't saved by the covenant of works. The covenant of works damned them just as much as it damned you or I. But they were saved by their belief in the Messiah that was coming. Concepts uh concepts like uh repentance, restoration, grace, forgiveness, sacrifice, propitiation, atonement, all of these things being pictured in the cultic religion that God gave Israel in the Old Testament. And so they weren't saved by works. They never were. No one was ever saved under that system, but they were saved under the covenant of grace that's coming. But now that Jesus has come, we know more fully what this grace is and and who this grace came through, who's Christ. And so now, Jew or Gentile alike, God's not a respector of persons. We're saved and justified by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by what we've done, but by what he did. [0:07:46] That's been the way the church has viewed God's relationship with humanity and how he saves people. In 1821, uh, a guy by the name of John Darby in what was called the Plymouth Brethren, which was just a tiny little, uh, cult, and I don't mean that word in necessarily a porative way, but a tiny little religious sect in Northern Europe uh, came up with a different scheme in which he said, well, it's much more complicated than all of that. There are these things called dispensations and seven different dispensations of time in which God uh God dealt differently with different people at different times in different places. And it was much more involved, a lot more complicated. And this is from where we get the concept of dispensationalism. [0:08:37] Sensationalism typically holds that there is a covenant with with Christians similar to the the covenant of grace that I explained but God also has a separate covenant with Jews and in this sense is what you call dual covenant almost like two different tracks. Now, they don't necessarily believe the dispensationalist that is that a Jew could be saved outside of Jesus Christ. [0:09:08] That that there are covenants, promises, and blessings that the Jew has access to that Christians don't on account of who they are related to. >> And you're saying that's that's a racial distinction that's being made. It's a so it's it's a little bit more complicated than just ethnicity, right? So if you were to talk to Ashkanazi or Sphartic Jews today and ask them, are you physically related to Abraham? You're going to get a lot of different answers. [0:09:40] Until the 20th century, they would all say no. They knew their history. They're not at all related ethnically uh to Abraham. They knew that they were European, but they would say, well, it's it's identity, right? And they use even today and it's well especially today language very similar to the trans movement almost like uh or the uh it's like what is a woman? A woman is whatever a woman says she is. And it's like right but that's a circular definition. What is a woman? They they might tell you that a Jew is one who identifies as such because the Ashkanazi and the Sphartic Jews are not at all related to Abraham. So, it's like, well, it's part ethnicity, but it's part cultural identity, and it's part religion. And there are some Jews that have only one of three of those things. [0:10:29] And there are some that have all three. >> Very few that have all three, but some that do. >> Interesting. >> So, it's a complicated answer. >> Yeah. And that's that's a question that I think we're going to come back to in a minute. But one of the other hallmarks, if you will, of dispensationalism, one of the ways that you can kind of, I guess, figure out if you if you happen to go to a dispensationalist church, but you you've never heard that term before, uh you or you're you're totally unaware that you you've been following dispensationalist theology. One of the hallmarks of this is the pre-tribulation rapture. Um, and so one of the questions that I have is, you know, how do you wrestle with the historical roots of this idea which came from John Darby and and a Scottish teenager as opposed to something that has existed long-standing over church tradition. This is something that's fairly new. It's basically a hundred years old. Um, >> you you can you can get into the weeds really quick on this topic if you insist on it being esqueological, but sometimes uh that's that does more harm than good in trying to to clear things up. What I mean by that is well, you're right, for example, that the pre-trip rapture came from dispensationalism, but a futurist esquetology is very old. [0:11:46] I mean, a futurist esquetology believing in a literal millennial reign that's coming. That was the first esquetology of the church for at least 300 years. I am what you call a historic premillennialist, meaning that I believe that certain things uh are are futuristic about the end times. So, I don't believe that all of the various prophecies in the New Testament or Old Testament, Daniel for example, have been fulfilled. But the preerttrib rapture aspect of that uh that is very much uh a a dispensational idea because once in their view the church is raptured out see they almost view the church as an intermission like God dealt with the Jewish people then there's the church God in the rapture gets them out of the way and then he resumes and picks back up with the Jewish people and then they they take a front and center role in in the uh in God wrapping up all things in the end times. But esquetology can, as I said, get us in the weeds where we start uh we start complicating the subject so much so it's hard to come up with the distinctives of dispensationalism and that's what I want to provide for you. [0:13:03] So in your question, it's like how do you tell someone who's been indoctrinated by dispensational uh ideology? So the I'd say the most prominent one is what we saw exhibited by Ted Cruz in that now famous interview with Tucker Carlson when he says listen I ran for Senate in Texas in order to stick up for the Israeli people right at which point everybody in Texas is like what you what like why wasn't this in your campaign material? You ran here to help people in another country. That's weird. And so he defends this to Tucker by halfway citing the what we call the Abrahamic promise. And I, as Tucker demonstrated, Cruz didn't even know what chapter, not what chapter, he didn't know what book of the Bible that was in. [0:13:56] I'm not totally sure that Cruz knew whether that was in the Old Testament or the New Testament. But when you hear people refer to Israel as God's chosen people or Israel as God's nation, um that's dispensational uh theology. So the question is, what do they do with Genesis 12:3? When God says, "I'm going to bless you, Abraham, and I'm going to bless those that bless you, and I'm going to curse those that curse you." The dispensationalist would say, "This is God's promise to the Jewish people. that they're special and that he's going to bless people who do good things to them and he's going to curse those who do bad things to them. [0:14:40] Well, that's probably the majority of American evangelicals. However, here's what your listeners need to understand. The thought, the concept, the idea that Jews are the chosen people of God and that Israel is a special nation to God and that they are his chosen people. The idea that the Abrahamic promise is that God blesses Jews would have been so foreign to anyone before the year 1820. [0:15:11] And frankly, it would have been foreign to anyone before Scofield when the idea was propagated among the masses in the marginal notes of Oxford's Bible that they put Scofield's name on that they would have they would have looked at such if if a person said, "I think the Jews are God's chosen people. I think Israel is God's nation." Almost any theologian, not almost, any theologian would have looked at them with the skunk eye. Like, what are you talking about? [0:15:42] Where did you get that idea? Why on earth would you say Jews are God's chosen people? What's what's wrong with you? They would look at the Abrahamic promise and interpret it exactly as the Apostle Paul says the Abrahamic promise should be interpreted in Galatians chapter 3. So we call it exposition. Exposition is when you take what the scripture says and then you draw out of it its meaning and you explain what it says. And that's the goal of preaching and teaching. [0:16:17] Here's God's word. Let's unpack it. What does that mean for us? It's exposition. And in Galatians chapter 3, which was written to the church in Galatia that had become overcome by a group of heretics known as the Judaizers. They taught, well, they taught dispensation, a dispensational idea. [0:16:39] They taught that Jews had access to covenant blessings and covenant promises irrespective of Christ. that they didn't have to believe in Jesus at all, but by virtue of their ethnic lineage, by virtue of their culture and the religion they claimed, away from Christ, absent of Christ, God had special blessings and privileges for them. So, the Judaizers had come in. Paul names them as heretics and he explains the Abrahamic promise in in Genesis 12 in Galatians 3. And he says this promise and he quotes it. I will bless those that bless thee and curse those that curse thee. He says this is for Abraham's seed. Because the promise in the promise in in Genesis, it says, "And this promise is for you and your seed." He says it does not say seeds. Paul Paul says it says seed. Now in your version, if you're using a newer version, it may say offspring. And same concept. You may have heard it said offsprings. It doesn't say offsprings. [0:17:43] It says offspring. Who is the seed of Abraham? And Paul explains in Galatians 3, the seed of Abraham is not the Jewish people. The seed of Abraham is Jesus Christ. Jesus is the one who is prophesied as the seed in Genesis 3. The proto evangelism in the scripture, the first prophecy in the Holy Bible about Jesus Christ. Adam and Eve sin and God says, "I am going to from the seed of the woman crush the serpent's head." Well, this is Christ. This is Jesus prophesied in the Old Testament. And so all of the characters of the Old Testament. So when you think about any Bible study you ever heard about in church, any any Bible character that Phil Viser ever made a v a veggie cartoon about, all of those characters are in the Bible because that's Jesus's family lineage. All of them down the line. So if you know about that Bible character, you know about them because they're related to Jesus. Jesus is the seed. That's why he's not only the son of Abraham, he is the he is the the branch of David, the stem of Jesse's rod. That's why it was significant that Jesus is born in Bethlehem. All of that. [0:19:03] So, the Old Testament is telling the story of this promise that Abraham believed in and Moses believed in and David believed in this Christ who's coming, the Messiah that they put their faith in and by which they were saved. He's the seed, Paul says. And so all who are in Christ have the se have the blessings of the seed. The Abrahamic promise is that God will bless those who bless Christ and curse those who curse Christ. And that's why he says in Galatians chapter 3, it's all those who believe who are the children of Abraham. And he's been working on this idea, the Apostle Paul, throughout the course of his whole ministry. I mean, in Romans chapter nine, he explains, "Not all who are the physical lineage of Abraham are actually of Abraham. They're not children of the promise." Okay? And so he talks about some of those who are physically related to Abraham, but they they're not children of God's promise. [0:20:10] Ishmael, Esau, they were not in that lineage of Christ, the promised one. And so in Galatians chapter 3, the Apostle Paul says, "This promise is about Christ and all those who are in Christ. And if you are in Christ, you are the children of Abraham. And if you don't have faith in Jesus Christ, you're not the children of a of Abraham." This is why in Romans chap 11, the Apostle Paul says that unbelieving Jews have been cut off and severed by God himself from the tree of faith. They're no longer attached to Abraham. The promise to Abraham that all of the world would be blessed through him is fulfilled in Jesus, not in the Jewish people. So, there was this song that you probably learned in church. I don't know if you did or not. I did. Uh, father Abraham had many sons. Many sons had father Abraham. I am one of them and so are you. So, let's just praise the Lord. Right arm. Right. That's how the [laughter] song go. Well, that's covenantal theology. It's a reputation of dispensationalism that by faith we, that is Christians, Jew or Gentile, Eskimo or starving Pygmia, New Guinea, doesn't matter. you're a child of Abraham if you believe in Jesus Christ and the promise is for you. So because the the the dispensational error is to apply that promise to people who deny Jesus. They're believing in multiple covenants. Yeah, God has a covenant with Christians by which he saves them. But God also has a covenant with those who don't believe in his son. And of course, this puts the entire New Testament on its head because I mean, the scriptures tell us, Jesus tells us, "If you deny me before men, I'll deny you before the father." The apostle Paul and Peter and John, a primary purpose of their apostolic writing in in letter after letter among the the New Testament epistles was screaming like emphatically declaring to the Jews in almost every epistle, being related to Abraham gets you nothing. Without Christ, you have no promise outside of Christ. You have no blessing outside of Christ. You have no covenant with outside of outside of Christ. And dispensationalism says, "No, that's not true because uh the Israelis are related to Abraham." And of course, let's let's just pretend let's be devil's advocates for a moment and say that they are. Of course, we know they're not, but let's just say that, yeah, okay, they're all physically related to Abraham and that the Palestinians are not in fact more Seemetic than the Ashkanazi Jew. [0:23:15] When we say or when the dispensationalist says they have special privileges because they're Israelis, they're disagreeing with a fundamental perspective and sermon preached regularly by the apostles that says no, no, otherwise. So, for example, in second Peter chapter 2, the apostle Peter, he he introduces the letter. He says he's writing uh to to Christians to the church and he's he's speaking to a church that that's full of Gentiles also Jews but all of them believing in Christ. And he says to that audience that contained lots of Gentiles, a large portion. He says, "You are a chosen nation, a royal priesthood, a people for God's own possession." And of course, these are phrases borrowed from the book of Deuteronomy and Exodus in reference to Israel. But he takes the terms that God gave Israel and he applies it to the church. You're a chosen nation. You're a royal priesthood. You're a people for God's own possession. Now, think just for a second how perverse and upside down it is to have Ted Cruz's dispensationalist perspective. [0:24:36] Okay, we're applying the Abrahamic promise to the Jews, to the Israelis. Okay, and we're assuming beyond all scientific and historic evidence that they're Jews, that they're actually related to them, even though that's not true. Let's just assume it. And because of that, we're going to overlook all of this horrendous stuff Israel does. And we're going to take their side no matter what. It doesn't matter if they kill nine innocent people for every one enemy combatant. It doesn't matter if they're killing people who are also physically related to Abraham as the Palestinians are. It doesn't matter if they spy on the United States like regularly all the time. None of that matters. [0:25:26] the only thing that matters is that they're chosen and we're going to bless them. But then you, you know, you learn a little bit more about Talmudic Judaism and you learn that Talmudic Judaism is not the Judaism of Moses. It's not the Judaism of of King David. It's it's it's it's not the the the Judaism of the Old Testament at all. It's that the cult of the Pharisees, the ones who killed Christ, the ones who accused Christ of sinning regularly based upon the rabbitic interpretation, this thing grew and evolved and was sort of designed in the 400 years after Christ. It was created as an antithesis religion to Christianity. It was made designed to be oppositional to Christianity. Talmudic Judaism is the most anti-explicitly anti-Christian religion on the face of the earth. I would say I think it can be proven it's more emphatically anti-Christian than the church of Satan. [0:26:32] >> Church of Satan is a very like handsoff like the Talmud teaches that Jesus is boiling in a cauldron of feces in hell that he was a sorcerer and his mother a Their religious teaching curses Christ. And we are, get this now, because of the dispensational Ted Cruz interpretation of Genesis 12 that no one had until 18:21 and almost no one had heard of until the 20th century, they're now blessing those who curse Christ. [0:27:07] And they're cursing those who bless Christ. And that's that's tragic that that's happening. And it's being propagated by evangelicals who frankly just don't know any better. They they hear we're supposed to bless Israel, so we bless Israel. They don't stop to consider that here we have in the New Testament Paul, the Apostle Paul, God's handchosen instrument to bring the gospel to the Gentiles. Pharisee of Pharisees, all of the Jewish credentials in the world, saved. And the Apostle Paul says Jesus is the seed. That promise goes for gentile Christians, Jewish Christians, it doesn't matter. So long as they have faith in Christ. That's the danger of dispensational uh esquetology or dispensationalism in general is it turns the promises of the Bible absolutely upside down. And the next thing you know, Americans 2,000 years later are taking the heresy of the Judaizers and preaching it from the pulpit and saying, "We have to defend the wickedness of Israel and overlook all of the horrendous things that that country does because they've misapplied uh the message of the scripture that should be clear to the Christian reader." >> Wow. [0:28:28] I couldn't have put I couldn't and you know you're if I'm not mistaken you you come from a Protestant background. Is that correct? Like >> Yeah. >> Right. And so I'm I'm a Catholic and we're speaking the same language here. It's amazing to me how the the dispensationalists are so far off track. [0:28:46] It's it's it's amazing and and you brought up some really interesting things too that I I don't think a lot of dispensationalists are aware of. And that is there have been a number of studies uh that have just come out. There was one I'm looking at in 2017. I'll put these on the screen. Um and and it shows that the Palestinians, the people in Gaza, the people that have been getting bombed, you know, how many uh tens of thousands of women, children, uh that have been murdered with American weapons, American money at the hands of Israel. uh that these people uh share up to 81 to 90% of their DNA of their lineage uh with the ancient Canaanites and Iron Age Judeans. [0:29:30] uh whereas some of these others like the the Ashkenazi Jews that have come in and since colonized in the late 1800s and onwards uh to the the founding of the state of Israel in 1948, these guys maybe at best share 40 to 55% of their DNA according to these studies that I'm looking at. Um >> Oh, >> is that wrong? [0:29:54] >> Yeah, that's much less [laughter] much less than that. >> Wow. So, okay. So let me let yeah let me let me explain that. So um the Ashkenazi uh heritage their history is very clear. Okay. So it's not conspiratorial. This isn't uh uh this this isn't like uh some bizarre right-wing alt-right Qanon myth or anything like that. Um, the Ashkanazi uh were converts to Judaism among Iranians back then known as Persians um within and and Grecians. So there was a a Grecian expat community, a Persian expat community in the region that we now know as Turkey 200 years before Christ. They had converted to Judaism. [0:30:50] They didn't intermar. Remember the Jews at, you know, the practicing Jews are not intermaring. They're not supposed to be. These are converts. They adopted Judaism about 300 years after Christ. So, this community is there in Turkey for 500 years. They're not at all related to Abraham in any way, but they're they're Jewish. They've adopted the religion or at least they've adopted the rabbitic teachings that grew into Talmudic Judaism over time. [0:31:22] [clears throat] >> And you know, keep in mind, no one has practiced actual Judaism since 70 AD. >> Yeah. The destruction of the temple >> requires a requires a priesthood. It requires sacrifice. And Jesus decreed an end to the Jewish religion when he decreed an end to the temple. It can't even be practiced after that. Uh and so they in and about 300 years after Christ then migrate into Europe. And so when you're talking Grecians and Persians, the you know Persia is the Middle East for sure, but the Middle East is not all Israel, right? So whenever you see a fact check um on X or in social media when someone says what I'm telling you which is the textbook accepted approved endorsed Ashkanazi history that they taught for for o over a thousand year oh 2,000 years um you'll see a claim if you follow the footnote to a Wikipedia page and it talks about genetic study done on the Ashkanazi Jew and it says uh that yeah yeah yeah they are in fact Grecian and then it says Middle Eastern well Middle Eastern is Turkey and Persia >> not not Seemetic they're not seemetic at all and you've got the Sphartic Jews that are also similarly Spanish so Benjamin Netanyahu's brother released his DNA I think this was in 2016 if memory serves and turns out he's sphartic thought he was more Ashkanazi so he's Polish and Spanish right so you have the president of the nation of Israel whose lineage is entirely European in the name of the Abrahamic promise bombing people who actually are related to Abraham albeit through Ishmamail So, [clears throat] uh, and then Christians are supporting this. That's the real irony is that you have a nation of Europeans killing people who actually are to some small degree much much greater than them related to Abraham. It's just mind-blowing. [0:33:43] >> That's incredible. I didn't I didn't even know that. And I've been I've been doing this and researching this and and in circles like this for, you know, well over a decade. As a matter of fact, you mentioned that you were Catholic and you know, I I didn't know that. So, I feel like I'm a Protestant that's still protesting. So, it's my obligation to tell you, you know, stop being Catholic. [0:34:04] >> That's okay. And I'm here to tell you to come home to the church. [laughter] >> Right. So, Darby did not just get his notions uh from nowhere, believe it or not. So, uh, in the Protestant Reformation, you have the drama between the papists and the Protestants, and they're hating each other, of course. [0:34:23] And about 300 years after Christ, the historic premillennial esquetology of the church fades. And that that's when, as I explained before, they're looking at most of the prophecies regarding the end times, and they're thinking they're future tense. These things are going to come. [clears throat] And then you had postmillennialism and amennialism that both well all of these things have come in and out of favor in the Christian church. They've all kind of had their day to to shine. And in during the Protestant Reformation um they looked at uh the the the pontiff, the pope of Rome as the antichrist, the man of son of predition. So you have all of these historic confessions of faith, the the H Highleberg, you've got mine, the Second London Baptist Confession of Faith, >> uh 1889, but that is uh you know, similar to the Westminster Confession of Faith that predates that and then a confession that that was taken from point is everyone was calling the Pope the Antichrist in the in the 15 and 1600s, right? Okay. They're like he's from Rome, you know, he's he's so that's set on seven hills and he set himself up against Christ. He claims to be the vicor of Christ. And so so that's the historic maloo. So you had a couple Jesuits in the 1500s that the Jesuits were uh Rome's appointed weapons in the counterreformation. So you've got the reformers and then launching this theological war against the reformers, you have the counterreformation led by the Jesuits. And so, Father Ribera, R I B- R A um sort of brought back to popularity futurism uh in which again all the prophecies are it was sort of a revival of historic premillennialism in a way saying no no no um the uh the prophecies in the old the prophecies rather uh esqueologically about the end times it's all future tense. So, the Pope can't be the Antichrist. [0:36:34] He's in the future. Well, this writing was pretty obscure, but we know from historic testimony that John Darby found it. John Darby lifted his dispensationalism from reading a couple of Jesuit priests 200 years later. And so it's so bizarre how all these things historically kind of twist and turn into one another, right? So if you went into an evangelical church that uh has the Left Behind series on the shelf and they believe in the imminent return of Christ >> and uh not the inevitable return of Christ, which we all believe in, right? [0:37:18] But the imminent that it could be any day now. It's the preacher of rapture like a thief in the night which they interpret to mean like secretively, >> right? >> All these if you were to tell them like you guys realize no one believed this until a couple hund couple hundred years, you know, ago, they'd be shocked. [0:37:36] They have no idea. They think that they stand with historic orthodoxy, but it's absolutely bizarre. And you can look at some of the contemporaries of uh Scofield like names that you and I would recognize uh at well maybe not you if you're Catholic but names that I would recognize as a Protestant of men of faith that we trust you know treasured theologians who had only the harshest possible things to say about Scofield because the idea of God having a covenant with Jews that was separate from his covenant with Christians was seen is so heretical that it was absolutely dangerous. And so you have Jews refer to that theology now, the theology of the historic Orthodox Church as replacement theology. [0:38:26] >> You guys practice replacement theology. Bro, replacement theology was the only theology of the Christian church for 1,800 years. And until this this these ideas became propagated because the Zionists at Oxford created and published and funded a Bible by Scofield and put their name on it and sent it all over the world. Nobody ever heard of it. You know, they they think that they're standing in the majority position. Well, they are maybe in 2025 American evangelicalism, but in all things considered, in the course of Christian history, they're absolutely alone in all of that because it's a bizarre, it's a bizarre idea. [0:39:08] >> Jesus, the scripture says the prophecies of God are all fulfilled and that Jesus in that is our yes and amen. Jesus is the fulfillment of every single prophecy given by God to his chosen people. It's fulfilled in Jesus Christ. Now, we've talked a little bit about Scoffield. Um, c can you give some more background on this guy because he seems like he was like a Wall Street guy. He was involved in some shady real estate scams in >> he was the Wall Street guy, I think. But yeah, so Scoffield had kind of a uh he had a little bit of a troubled past. He had he had been divorced, estranged from his wife, seems to have abandoned her, abandoned her. Um he had to step down from his political pos position after he was pretty credible credibly accused of some things. Um but yeah he became known he was an attorney became known uh for this propagating the ideas of of John Derby. The next thing we know he's in New York he's a member of an exclusive club that was very expensive uh to be a member of. We have no idea how he got the funds to do that other than he seems to have had as a patron this guy by the name of Utimire. [0:40:24] And this guy's really uh interesting. If you're a conservative and you hate the Federal Reserve, then this conspiracy theory gets even deeper because he is the guy that brought us the Federal Reserve. Believe it or not, >> he played and he was Jewish. Obviously, he was in banking and he loved the Fed Federal Reserve. So um he it appears as though he funds a trip of Scofield to go to Europe in particular England at which point he has a pow-wow at Oxford. Oxford was the hotbed of Zionism um in Great Britain and uh Oxford was in part funded by Jacob Rothschild. [0:41:12] And so he comes out of Oxford basically with a book deal. He produces the Bible. The reason I say it's it's Oxford's Bible is because Scoffield never owned it. His name was on it. He didn't own it. Oxford owned it. Now the question is why would a Jewish guy and why would Anttomire why would he take this interest in Scofield? Why would the Jewish Zionists, and when I say Zionists at Oxford, they weren't just Jewish Zionists. Zionists doesn't imply that they were Jewish. There were lots of of of non-Jewish Zionists in the UK who wanted a Jewish ethnic state in Palestine for several different reasons, including empire building, colonization, all sorts of different reasons. But why did they take interest in this creature with a bizarre esquetology? [0:42:08] Why did what did they get out of it? Like follow the money trail, right? Well, it's because the goal of the British Zionists was to create this this Jewish ethnostate um in Palestine. Um it was an important trade route. they needed an outpost there because of their colonization in India. And so from the 1800s onward, there was this um this movement in the UK to send the Jews of Europe to Palestine. I will say though, and this is an important caveat in the whole story, um, Theodore Herzel, the father of Jewish Zionism, that kind of started the whole idea of Jews going to Palestine to to to create a state. Um, Israel was not their first choice. So, a lot of people don't know this. They had they had uh suggested Siberia. [0:43:13] >> Madagascar I think was on the short list. >> Madagascar was one. Canada. Uh Galveastston, Texas, believe it or not. >> Wow. >> Ohio. New Jersey. Um the big [laughter] the big one was Argentina. And so Herzel, the father of modern Zionism, he wasn't a practicing Jew. He didn't he he was just a secular guy. So it had nothing to do with like fulfilling, you know, some esqueological mandate for the Jews to return to Palestine for any type of of religious purpose whatsoever. [0:43:51] But they caught wind of the Plymouth Brethren and Darby and this esquetology that's growing among Protestants and they thought, "What the heck?" So these Protestants believe that God is going to return quote unquote Jews to Israel or to Palestine as they called it then. Well, the thought then crosses their mind. The light bulb goes off over their head. We can use this and so use it. They did. [0:44:26] The next thing you know, it's like, hold on. and the the uh European Jewish uh excuse me, the World Jewish Congress, kind of like a group of influential Jews that met uh in Europe every year. Um the dialogue as they're discussing the various options, places where Jews could go, it was really interesting to see the light bulb go off over their head where they really didn't want to go to Palestine at all. Who wants it? It's a desert. like there's there's no natural resources there. But as soon as they tag teamed with this new perverted unbiblical uh sub-Christian esquetology dispensationalism, well then all of a sudden they could talk Europeans to getting on board. So like you know Theodore Herzel went and talked the pope, Pope Pius, he didn't want to have anything to do with this. [0:45:19] As a matter of fact, the early Zionists couldn't talk the Jews into it. They couldn't get Rothschild to to to to go along with this. You know, Rothschild's perspective and the perspective of most Jews early on in the in the 19th century hearing about Zionism for the first time is why would we do that? We are rich. We are influential. We have high positions of authority in countries all over Europe. Why would we want to ruin that? [0:45:48] What they were afraid of is that people would say, "You don't belong here. you belong in Palestine. And he's like, I like where I live. I want to stay here. Why would I why would I go there? And so, you know, when you combine all of that with the fact that, uh, Jews in Europe had been become very problematic every place they went. um you know they're they played a prominent role in in the 20th century in the Viomar Republic and in the Bolevik Revolution and in uh radical causes all over Europe but they had become kind of nuisances everywhere they were in Europe. Um because the Talmud has uh an ethic that is totally the opposite of biblical Christianity or historic Judaism. [0:46:37] Um they, you know, the Jews were the ones that ran the brothel, engaged in the sex trade, um engaged in usery and predatory lending. All this is historic fact. The coin shaving, all of that. And so they were uh quite at odds with uh Europeans in every country. It's it's real simple. Okay? So it's like this. If you have a shady, dirty gas station in your community where it's not just lotto, but they got nickel slots and they got video poker and it's because the homeless people on the corner panhandling take their quarters and they go and they put them in the nickel slots in the in the video uh you know uh gaming at the gas station. That's what they do with your nickels and quarters. [0:47:22] And then they have the Chinese uh counterfeit drugs, the opium drugs. they, you know, that that's not really opium. All of the stuff that should be illegal, but it's not. And for whatever reason in the internet age, they still have pornography behind the counter. They're just shady, nasty, disgusting businesses in our communities all across America. What ethnicity are the folks running those? [0:47:49] It's not people from the community that put an establishment, right, like that. Right. >> Right. It's people who are not from here that's solely the community with an establishment like that. In most of rural America, you go from county to county and you'll see these strip clubs out in the county and they're right on the county line. [0:48:08] They're outside the city limits, right? That's where people put the strip clubs. You know who owns those strip clubs? Not people from the city, not people from there. You don't put a strip club in your own town. You put one somewhere where you're not from. You don't want to do that to your own community. So, here you have the Jews without a homeland. [0:48:27] They're not from there. It's not their home. And so, they had historically been involved in some shady stuff, involved in in the early trans movement, in the LGBTQ movement, very sexually libertine. I mean, there's a reason why Telmudic Judaism had to move to a matrineal um genealogy in order to survive because they didn't know who their fathers were. [0:48:55] I mean, it was very sexually liberated, so to speak. You know, the myth of Judeo-Christian values is just one of the dumbest concepts. Like 87% of Jews in the United States vote Democrat. That's higher than the percentage of any other demographic. That's higher than the percentage of blacks, for example. [0:49:13] the Jews are voting overwhelmingly Democrat. Well, it's it's because they're not sitting in the synagogue reading Moses. They're they're learning the Talmud and it teaches the opposite of Christian ethics. It was created as an oppo religion. It was created to be a Christian antithesis religion. So, their beliefs are very different. Well, when you take that and you throw it into say 16th century Protestant Hungary, [snorts] uh, okay, that's going to be conflict. [0:49:43] So, the Europeans just kind of thought after a while, listen, the best thing for them and for us is to send them out. Let's get them away. So, Palestine seems like a good dumping ground to put them. But in order for that to be funded, in order for that to be uh in order for the world to really get behind that scheme, they needed Protestant Christians to get on board, particularly in the United States and Scoffield's marginal notes was the logical place to put it. So this idea and and in order to spread it all over the world and a lot of people don't understand the reason for the influence of Scofield's Bible. So um if you uh know of a church and you know think of think of a dispensational church in your head, one that has the Israeli flag and the Star of David on the stage. [0:50:40] >> I'm thinking of one. >> Okay. All right. So this is a lower socioeconomic church. All right. These are not your country club Christians for the most part. The average uh person in that congregation is probably not college educated and they're of a religious tradition that's what we call low church. Okay? In other words, not very lurggical. Uh it's not very organized and structured. And none of that is an insult because I go to a Bible a Bible church. All right? Like I'm an independent fundamentalist. So like those are my people I'm talking about. [0:51:17] I'm not digging them when I say that. All right. I'm country folk, simple folk. That's my people. All right. But in the American South, in what we now call the Bible belt, you had the Baptists that were the sod busting missionaries, and you had the circuit writing Methodists. And these two groups spread out and splintered in a thousand ways, especially in the 1840s. kind of splintered in a bunch of different directions into different denominations and groups. All right? You know, the Baptist split between the missionary Baptist, the Southern Baptist, Landmark Baptist, the General Baptist, all these various groups. But but they're all these very simple, rather uneducated people. And when you are low church, you don't have seminaries, you don't have Bible colleges, you don't have that fancy book learning, so to speak. And so Baptists, you know, the joke is they just kind of ordain anybody, right? The Methodists a little bit less so, but still like there's not exactly high clergical standards for who you're going to ordain. All it takes is like somebody's got a Bible and they're filled by the Holy Ghost and you know, you pat them on the back, you're a pastor now. Congratulations. These were pastors during the era of the Scofield Bible. These are these are preachers who never went to seminary, never went to Bible college, never imagined that they would. They didn't own a commentary. [0:52:44] They couldn't afford one. They'd probably never seen a commentary. They didn't have a Hebrew and Greek lexicon. They had their Bible. That's it. That's the one book that they would scrimp and and and save to be able to to to afford. They had a Bible. You know, one of the most famous sermons in the Southern Baptist Convention's history. Billy Baptist and his Bible. We had our Bible. [0:53:06] Well, what made Scoffield unique is that he had marginal notes, uh, commentary, explanation. Here's what that verse means. Well, just so happens that they went they went hog crazy over that. Like, that became their seminary. That became their Bible their their their Bible college. And so, you know, the whole joke is that the the dispensationalist trinity is father, son, and Scoffield notes. you know, it became them the authoritative word of God. And being rather uneducated, they didn't know what's they were reading in their marginal notes was not historic Christianity. They didn't know how bizarre it was. And so they all had this Bible and and that's how that idea spread everywhere. [0:53:56] >> Wow. That's that's incredible history, too. What's really interesting now with this church, you know, since I've started doing a couple of these podcasts, is they emphasize that these Jewish people are bad, that they're blind, that they're maybe even evil, but we have to support them because of the promises that will be fulfilled in the future. What would you say to a preacher, a minister or people like that that have this future promise of a fulfilled prophecy being dangled in front of them uh you know within this tradition >> of dispensationalism that has historically made all of these claims of the the tribulation, the rapture, it's going to happen in 1988 and it never happens, you know, over and over again. [0:54:44] What would you say um to >> So there are two basic defenses of dispensationalists when you talk to them about Israel. The first one is they're not that bad and the second one is and it doesn't really matter. So if you're talking to them if you're talking to them about Gaza and you're like listen um the typical NATO uh war or military conflict in modern times kills three combatants for every one innocent non-combatant. Okay? So you kill three bad guys for every innocent person. We call that collateral damage. That's uh from a wide spectrum of modern conflicts in the last 50 years. In Gaza, they're actually killing 10 innocent people for every one combatant. When you do the math on that, that means that they're enemy combatant uh or rather the civilian uh death ratio is 2,92% higher. [snorts] They're killing 2,092% higher number of innocent people. [0:55:47] >> Wow. >> Hamas killed a lot of innocent people on October 7 and since then the Israelis have killed at least 17,000 innocent children. >> And that's a conservative estimate. we've on on our podcast >> and that's only that's not counting through uh hunger and shutting off electricity to hospitals in the middle of life-saving surgery. Right. [0:56:10] >> We we've reported on on our podcast that uh there are credible reports that up to 19,000 children under the age of 18 have been killed. >> The first stage of that is uh which is the they're not that bad is well that's you're quoting the Gaza Ministry of Health and you're like no I'm quoting the Red Cross. I'm quoting the same NOS's that the Trump justice, excuse me, the Trump u um Secretary of State, State Department uses uh trusts to give us death counts in natural disasters and in and man-made disasters and wars all over the world. It's the same organizations giving us these stats. As a matter of fact, it's what the whistleblowers from inside the IDF are telling us. [0:56:53] >> Yeah. >> Like they're not, >> you know, these aren't collateral damage. I mean, are it was a few weeks ago, Israel's like, "Yeah, we killed eight journalists because one of them, we say, had ties to to Hamas." And they It's like they they knew they just admitted we on purpose killed seven innocent people. We knew they'd die. [0:57:14] It's not like, "Oh, we accidentally killed them. We knew they we we shot a missile in their tent. We knew they'd die. We got the one bad guy." All right. They'll blow up an entire apartment building because, you know, full of innocent women and children because there's bad guys in apartment 3C, right? [0:57:31] So, you know, the once you get the dispensationalist to see the facts, listen, here's how bad it is, okay? If Planned Parenthood is bad, this is worse. It's, well, listen, at the end of the day, it doesn't really matter because that's God's people. we're going to we're going to stand by them. Well, okay, let's look at that biblically. You've probably heard the expression, God is not a respector of persons. I remember my grandma telling me that uh in order to to kind of uh lecture me about why the poor folk down the road uh are not to be despised. [0:58:15] I remember my school teacher, who was also my my Sunday school teacher in first and second grade, couldn't get away from that lady, tell me God's not a respector of persons, in teaching me that God doesn't love white people any more than he loves black people. We hear that phrase, God's not a respector of persons, used all the time in in in many different ways to teach us God doesn't favor anybody because of those external attributes. And to that I say yes and amen. But I never heard it growing up in a dispensational church applied towards Jews. And yet all four times that expression is used in the New Testament. [0:58:59] God is not a respector of persons. The context of the passage is why God does not in fact favor Jews more than Gentiles. God is not a respector of persons. And so I believe that if you can get the dispensationalist to look at the scripture to say, "Okay, I know you have in your head this esqueological scheme. [0:59:26] God's going to do this in the future with the Jews. Let's let's table the esquetology for a moment. Let's let's okay, the end times. Let's let's cross that bridge when we get there. What does this verse mean?" So, I'll give you an example. In Romans chapter 11, the dispensationalist will say, "Listen, we you're grafted in to the Jewish tree. You're grafted into them as though it's this this Hebrew tree that we're a part of by faith." And that it says that, "Yeah, there there are some who who are not a part of that tree of faith right now, but God is going to put them back on the tree, and God is going to save all of Israel one day. God's going to save all of Israel. [1:00:12] Specifically says that in Romans chapter 11. All right. This is why exposition is important. Let's go verse by verse through this. Let's exedute what this what this text says and handle it one bit at a time. It's not a Hebrew tree. It is the tree of faith. Christ Jesus is the roots. And it specifically says that those Jews who do not believe, God has cut them off. And it's not just that the believing Gentile has been grafted onto the tree. It says grafted in their place. What do you call that? I call that replacement. I don't know about you. [1:00:53] >> And then it does say in fact that if Jews do not persist in unbelief that God will graft them back in. But that's not a special promise to the Jews. Who would God not graft in if they had faith? Again, it's the proverbial Eskimo or starving pygmy in New Guinea. It doesn't matter who you are, the Italian, the African, the Nubian. It doesn't matter. South American, it does anyone who believes gets grafted onto the tree of faith. That promise is not special for the Jews. It's just saying that they're not hopelessly condemned as it says in Romans 11, if they do not persist in unbelief. [1:01:33] And the Jews in Israel, 99% of practicing Jews follow the Talmud. Well, and 100% of unbelieving Jews don't believe, right? Like definitionally, [laughter] uh they're persisting in unbelief by not being a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. They're cut off. There's no promise for them. There's no covenant for them. [1:01:59] They're cut off. Furthermore, as it then goes on in Romans 11 and says, "In the end, all of Israel will be saved." As a matter of fact, it quotes an Old Testament prophetic passage and says, "The deliverer of Zion will save them." Well, who is the deliverer of Zion if they do not persist in unbelief? Well, the deliverer of Zion is Jesus, right? [1:02:24] That's why D is capitalized in that verse in every English translation. The deliverer is Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ will save them if they do not persist in unbelief. However, what does it mean? All of Israel will be saved. Well, that doesn't mean that every single Jewish person on the face of the planet, if they're related to Abraham, will believe. Because in Romans chapter nine, the apostle Paul has defined the term Israel. In which he says, "Not all who are of Israel are really of Israel. [1:03:00] It's only those who believe that are of Israel." What makes you Israel? What makes you chosen? What makes you beloved to God is faith in Jesus Christ given to you by God the Holy Spirit predestined by God the Father actualized in God the Son is the object of faith. Of course all who believe will be saved. [1:03:29] It's not a it's not a prophetic utterance to the inhabitants of Tel Aviv that all of them will be saved. all of Israel will be saved. And two chapters before, keep in mind, these are epistles that are meant to be read in one sitting to people sitting down in a church, right? In reading time, three minutes before, Paul just told them that everyone who believes in Christ is Israel. Then he says, "All of Israel will be saved." No crap. All who believe in Jesus will be saved. That's why the scripture says the old covenant is obsolete. It has decayed and is passing away. It has been replaced with the gospel, the new covenant. And what makes the new covenant, quoting Jeremiah, what makes the new covenant better than the old covenant, and that is that in the new covenant, everyone in it is saved. [1:04:24] In the old covenant, you could have covenant members like say Judas's Scariot who was circumcised. He was of a tribe. He was the lineage of Abraham. and Judas split hell open when he died. That covenant didn't save him. But the new covenant, one in which we enter by faith in Jesus Christ, all who are saved in that, that's why the scripture says it's a it's a better covenant than the old one. So, in in light of all of this, uh yeah, of course, all of Israel will be saved. Now, that's a total mindmeld for the dispensationalist who basically is I I in most churches not taught that Galatians chapter 3 even exists. And when they hear from from Romans 11, they hear one verse about all of Israel will be saved or, you know, you're grafted into their tree without explaining that first before we've been grafted in, they've been cut off and we've replaced them. And so the apostolic writers in every epistle, they're they're man, they are pleading, they're begging their audience to understand, please do not think for a moment that because Abraham is your father. You've got a leg up with God. Who your relatives are cannot save you. Esau, God hated from the womb and he was of Abraham. He was not saved. [1:05:52] you in the same way will not be saved unless you are in the covenant of Christ. And he's like, you know, the Apostle Paul, he's so frustrated at the Judaizers. He calls them the super apostles because they acted like they were better than him, like they were superior. And and he, you know, in frustration, his heart is like breaking. I'm trying to get you people to understand you're not special without Christ. And so what do the dispensationalist preachers do? [1:06:25] They run out there, stand in their pulpit, and tell tell their their audience, their church, that Jews are special and they're God's chosen people and God's holy nation. basically contradicting a major theme and message of the New Testament scriptures that there is no salvation to be found outside of Jesus Christ. There's no covenant, no blessing outside of Christ. [1:06:51] That's amazing. Now, for anybody that has been watching and following along with this conversation, JD, you're a prolific writer. You've got a Substack if you want to tell people how to find you uh and find what you've written just in case. there there's a lot of people that are out there that over the past couple of years since October 7th they've seen their pastors get kind of crazy with this stuff and start pushing it uh to the detriment of American interest to the detriment of their own people's interest they're starting to question you know what am I doing here is is this the truth and I think you've got a lot of these questions answered for them so if you could please uh just give a a little bit on how people can find you >> yeah insight to insight is the name of the Substack. Both insights are, you know, they're spelled differently. It's insight to insight. Um, and if you just if you just Google it, you'll you'll find it. And, uh, yeah, I put out free content about three or four days a week and put out paid content the other three or four days a week. But even in the with the articles that have a payw wall, I always put the payw wall far enough into the article that you can get something out of it um, for free. But I try to provide the intellectual material that people need to know um if they're going to make a difference uh in their culture. And so that's that's what I try to provide. So insight to insight or if you want to follow me on X, it's lost my hats. [1:08:18] >> All right. Well, thank you so much. We'll be uh putting all of the show links. We'll be putting his website in the in the show links below. So uh anybody that's interested in following up and learning more, you'll be able to get JD stuff there. So, thank you so much for joining me tonight, JD. [1:08:32] >> Thanks, man. Bless you.